TV Fanatic: Supergirl Round Table: Can Lena be Trusted?

sorry for the late review, been a busy week.

It seems most things have been hit on so I am just going to say I felt it was a great episode with a lot of potential depth for future stories.

I see some have picked up on the chess pieces alluding to checkmate. let me take it 1 step further; back in episode 3 when the president was coming into town to sign the alien amnesty act. If you recall Snapper took over James' meeting and began to dole out assignments, and many of them seemed pretty smartly done with a vast variety of demos covered. Didnt go get an interview with Lena Luthor seem like a weird choice. Sure she was a new character and maybe they just wanted to play with all the new toys, but did you know that Snapper is a pawn in Checkmate. Maybe he sent her to see Lena for a reason past what was the commonly thought obvious reason. Kara was then greeted with an alien detection device, how many people bought that her heat vision made the device work wrongly? or do you think maybe it just collected some DNA or something?

Another giant easter egg in the Luthor vault was the atomic axe. I am sure most think its the axe from Vartox, but that axe was destroyed. I do believe that axe belongs to the Persuader who is a member of the fatal five which happens to be a villain group to the legion of superheroes. I am sure many here know Mon-El becomes a member and I would bet we will see that play out perhaps at the start of season 3.

Very much in "agreeance" with the above posters who are sick of Supergirl (the most powerful female in this spiral of the Galaxy) being rescued by her sister or J'onn or the Petticoat Junction Volunteer Fire Department. That trend needs to change immediately....it ruined an otherwise good ep for me, I like Katie McGrath quite a bit she brings to Calista Flockhart gravitas to all her eps....Supergirl works best in comics, TV and movies when she is self confident, self reliant and self rescuing no matter what mishaugas she faces....

JF

Since the show is already confirmed for a third season, I think it's certainly possible they are setting up a concept for later on, borrowing again from DC comics history.

Chess pieces were used as ranks in the intelligence/covert operations agency Checkmate in the comics.

What if Cadmus is "officially" destroyed at the end of this season. But then someone in the government decides not to let all its resources go to waste? General Lane comes to mind.

Recruiting someone wealthy, brilliant and familiar with most of the alien/super community to run it would make for an interesting "counterweight" to the current DEO.

Yep. I'm thinking Lena - "White Queen".

Plus, the director of the agency in the comics was someone we've already met: Maxwell Lord.

Setting up a situation wher Lena had to keep secrets from Kara/Supergirl "for the greater good" could add drama to their friendship.

Plus, if Max returns, he'd undoubtedly have his own agenda.

Been thinking about it....I think the writers were trying to make us believe Lena is "bad" with that ending. But, hmmmmmm, now I believe she's actually going to go after her MOTHER in "Luthor style"--that's she'g going to be more like her DAD than brother and "step-mom." Now that she knows she's a Luthor because of her DAD's blood, she's going to perhaps be more a super hero than super villain. Either that, OR she's going to become revengeful--going after her step-mom for the wrong reasons. But, I think she adores Kara too much and respects Supergirl, and is grateful to her...that she won't become a villain in THAT sense of the word. Maybe in a future episodes we see Kara needing to "talk Lena off the edge." And, maybe this works, or maybe it's her revenge that eventually puts her at odds with Kara/Supergirl.

I like this a lot. I hope that is how it comes down. I mean, I don't want her to end up on the opposite side of Kara. But, seeing her trying to take down Lillian and having Kara support her on some things and have a conflict with her on others would be interesting. I hope their friendship will remain strong because Kara needs a woman friend, and I rather like Lena and their whole dynamic.

But, I don't want her to become all James and become yet another superhero. What I mean is, I'd rather she still retain some traits that would make her look out for herself or her corporation, but be someone who would risk a lot for her friends, who could eventually include rest of the gang.

Thanks, Kelly, evrafter, and others on your thoughts of this episode. I have another note I wish to make after rewatching the episode 5 times. (I really think it's that good.). It regards Lena's closing scene. I used to play chess and there are two things that come to mind. White (Lena's piece) always goes first and secondly she won with and is still studying a white rook or knight. I wonder if there is a key clue and symbol in that choice. I raise the concept of the "white knight" who is a savior and a chess piece that is highly maneuverable and dangerous. As the EPs love to play around with symbols and Easter eggs, I just wonder if this is an indication of Lena's character. In any event I would not want to be Lillian with Lena on the loose.

Just a thought.

Argo

Checkmate...

Thanks, Kelly, evrafter, and others on your thoughts of this episode. I have another note I wish to make after rewatching the episode 5 times. (I really think it's that good.). It regards Lena's closing scene. I used to play chess and there are two things that come to mind. White (Lena's piece) always goes first and secondly she won with and is still studying a white rook or knight. I wonder if there is a key clue and symbol in that choice. I raise the concept of the "white knight" who is a savior and a chess piece that is highly maneuverable and dangerous. As the EPs love to play around with symbols and Easter eggs, I just wonder if this is an indication of Lena's character. In any event I would not want to be Lillian with Lena on the loose.

Just a thought.

Argo

I really liked that the episode was indeed centred around Kara. Kara-Lena friendship is great; and I liked Argo's take on the character.

I do hope Lena turns out supportive of Kara even after the reveal though. Because I don't want the blood will tell, "Luthor is a Luthor" misinformation reinforced. It would be really great to see Lena struggle with it and eventually decide that Luthors can be good too!

Kara giving him the side eye, which was being ready to defend her sister not making googoo eyes.

Yes.. the side-eye was about how Mon El would react, but at the end, it was definitely approval and liking (and romance). Considering that Winn, James and J'onn had the same reaction, Kara's approval (approval on the scale of he did something magnificent) was completely unwarranted.

I liked James in this episode. He is great when he is Kara's friend and CatCo boss. That comparison about trust was weird though. Very different beasts "trusting Lena's motives" and "not fearing for James' life."

That is one of the things James still doesn't get. Anytime anyone has said anything even the least bit negative in terms of Guardian he goes way off, and takes it the wrong way. Kara has not said one time that she doesn't trust him, or have faith in him, or that he isn't hero. Not once, yet those are the things that he sees as her not giving him in their relationship. When in reality, it comes down to one thing, she just wants him to be safe....nothing more, nothing less.

Been thinking about it....I think the writers were trying to make us believe Lena is "bad" with that ending. But, hmmmmmm, now I believe she's actually going to go after her MOTHER in "Luthor style"--that's she'g going to be more like her DAD than brother and "step-mom." Now that she knows she's a Luthor because of her DAD's blood, she's going to perhaps be more a super hero than super villain. Either that, OR she's going to become revengeful--going after her step-mom for the wrong reasons. But, I think she adores Kara too much and respects Supergirl, and is grateful to her...that she won't become a villain in THAT sense of the word. Maybe in a future episodes we see Kara needing to "talk Lena off the edge." And, maybe this works, or maybe it's her revenge that eventually puts her at odds with Kara/Supergirl.

Thus the ever so creepy, "I really like this game" was perhaps actually foreshadowing her taking on Lillian and NOT Supergirl.

"I really like this game," as in "Two can play at this game...MOTHER."

I really enjoyed this episode like everyone else actually it has become one of my favorite episodes of this season.
when Cadmus comes back in the game everything becomes more tense and I really crave for the tension and action when Kara goes against Cadmus! I guess everyone here has already mentioned the good points so I jump to my own thoughts:

first of all I can't get over thinking what was in that box Lillian snatched from Lex's vault?!!! can it be an ultimate weapon to kill Kryptonians, like a new Kryptonite, one which wouldn't explode? or Aliens in general? or does it have anything to do with Jeremiah coming back in episode 15?! really my mind is swirling with possibilities!

Also the objects in that vault were breath taking! I literally felt a chill in my bones seeing all the deathly things that could harm our girl in one room! Melissa Benoist's cries of pain this episode broke my heart she's such a fantastic actress. one the other hand I'm not sure if the contents of the vault survived the explosion... It would be a shame that all of them just disappear from the show for ever. specially Lex's war suit! I was looking forward to see it later in action why would they show us all that and take it away so quickly?

on the bright side I'm pretty sure the Black Mercy didn't make it

another part that send a chill down my spine was kid Lena!!!!!! with her "I really like this game!" and I was like oh no! she's EVIL! Run Kara Run! ( or rather Fly Kara!Fly! ) )

I'm totally confused whether she's good or bad. guess that's the whole point the writers mean. they want us to be doubtful. I hope they get along in the end and eat doughnuts like nothing ever happened

P.s: I almost forgot. I remember someone mentioned why Jonn got there so late. I think it's because Kara is much faster.

This is, by far the best episode of the season so far since 2x01 and 2x02. Lots of references to season 1 and many mentions of Superman, who hardly anybody has talked about since he appeared earlier.
It was great to see Kara save several people by doing some heavy lifting and have those said people cheer for her afterward. We rarely see those kinds of scenes anymore.

I really liked that the episode was indeed centred around Kara. Kara-Lena friendship is great; and I liked Argo's take on the character.

I do hope Lena turns out supportive of Kara even after the reveal though. Because I don't want the blood will tell, "Luthor is a Luthor" misinformation reinforced. It would be really great to see Lena struggle with it and eventually decide that Luthors can be good too!

Kara giving him the side eye, which was being ready to defend her sister not making googoo eyes.

Yes.. the side-eye was about how Mon El would react, but at the end, it was definitely approval and liking (and romance). Considering that Winn, James and J'onn had the same reaction, Kara's approval (approval on the scale of he did something magnificent) was completely unwarranted.

I liked James in this episode. He is great when he is Kara's friend and CatCo boss. That comparison about trust was weird though. Very different beasts "trusting Lena's motives" and "not fearing for James' life."

Supergirl: Can Lena Luthor really be trusted after that reveal?, ew.com article with comments from Andrew Kreisberg.

First time I ever haven’t gotten to watch an episode the night it aired so I rushed home to watch today ASAP. I’m so glad Kara is in a better place now. She seemed so alone in the last two episodes but some alone time isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Highlights for me.
1. Alex introducing Maggie to the gang. Winn and James’s not surprisingly taking a beat to process Alex is gay then going OK and moving on with life. J’onn could have done the same thing but I thought it was sweet that he knew but trusted that she would tell him when she was ready. Both Alex’s parent (Eliza) and parental figure (J’onn) knew before she told them. Mon-El's reaction was basically like James and Winn’s with the addition of Kara giving him the side eye, which was being ready to defend her sister not making googoo eyes.
2. Lena finding out she is a blood Luthor. I believe that part of the story but not necessarily anything else Lillian said.
3. For the first time since he became Guardian I didn’t think James was a complete jerk. He was right in agreeing with Snapper on publishing the story based on available evidence. I am immensely happy that James and Kara agreed to be friends again without her apologizing.
4. Kara letting off steam at concrete blocks. Sometimes a girl's just got to punch something. That looked like all Melissa, no stunt double, she’s really upped her action game this season. I liked that Mon-El stayed and talked to her even calling her out on her own words after seeing that, a lesser man might have hightailed it right back up those stairs. That scene had the Cheryl Crow song “Strong Enough” playing in my head. For those who’ve never heard the song see the attachment. The specific section that popped in my head was "When I've shown you that I just don't care, When I'm throwing punches in the air, When I'm broken down and I can't stand, Would you be man enough to be my man?"
5. Kara’s unwavering support of her friend. Moving forward Winn must scan all video involving Cadmus or the Luthors.
6. Kara and Lena eating donuts together.
7. Kara just cannot catch a break. Every time she goes to kiss a guy something interrupts the moment.
8. One question why didn’t J’onn go with Kara to fight Metallo?
Side notes:
1. At this point I don’t think Lena knows Kara is Supergirl. Not because Lena isn’t smart, she’s scary smart, but because she doesn’t want to see it. Even the smartest people won’t see what they don’t want to be true. Last season Lucy said she suspected but didn’t want it to be true. Weather Lena stays good or turns evil is going to depend on how she reacts when she finds out her friend Kara is a super. I think Lena really wants to be friends with Kara but the Luthor in her might take over when she finds out. Can a Super and a Luthor truly be friends? Here’s hoping the women can succeed in friendship where the men failed.
2. Let’s have more cop Maggie, I want her to be part of the team not just Alex’s girlfriend. We must have a Kara/Maggie talk. Maggie knows the Danvers sisters aren’t “typical” siblings and that’s the root of some of Alex’s issues. If I were Maggie I would want to make sure Kara isn’t encouraging Alex’s “I don’t deserve to be happy” issues. It wouldn’t hurt for Kara to hear from Maggie that she respects her special bond with Alex. The good news is both love and want Alex to be happy so this isn’t an issue.
3. Kara saying she’s really good at standing up for other people but not herself perfectly fits the character and really hit home for me. I have had to learn to ask what would I do for a friend in the same situation and do the same for myself.

9.5 out of 10 for me....

Easily my 2nd favorite episode this season behind changes
.
Positives and Negatives:

The Luthor story line was wonderfully written and opens up so much for the future villainy and heroism of this family....

ABSOLUTELY loved Kara sticking up for her friend as fiercely as she did.

Loved the scenes at CatCo even the ones with James, HOWEVER, I think I realized another thing that he needs to learn. Kara has faith in him as James she has proven that time and time again in the 1st Season, she just doesn't trust and have faith in him as Guardian because I think she is probably afraid that he will do something extremely stupid trying to be like her and Clark and now seeming to want to best Mon-El as well.....he won't ever be able to do that and she knows it, but he is too stubborn to see it. That was part of my .5 off of this perfect 10. But there was positive in those scenes as well, both actors played them very well, and I loved the fact that they are going back to being "friends" that certainly has been missed.

The action was fantastic, but as others have stated, I would have much rather Kara had defeated Metallo on her own and saved Lena. I am REALLY getting tired of the need for help all the time, I hope the writers read these and see that the fans here, and on twitter are REALLY GETTING TIRED OF THAT... She could have come back with a head butt, and taken the Kryptonite out threw it across the room and high tailed it out of there....and that would have cost them less money as well considering they had to have the CGI of Jonn there in the scene. That was the other part of my .5 taken off the 10.

LOVED, LOVED, LOVED #Karamel in the end, but dang it, what's with messin' with the kiss. Grrrrrr....

A fine episode. Of course, Supergirl can fly through the side of a mountain. You almost do not see it happening. For once we do see Supergirl in horizontal flight. We had rather more of that last season. A few complainers will note that once again Supergirl had to be rescued by someone on the DEO. In contrast, at the end of the pilot Supergirl beat Vartox singlehandedly.

I was slightly disappointed that MM came to the rescue of Supergirl in the end fight, I was particularity keen for her to defeat Metallo on her own which she is entirely capable of doing of course.

Loved that horizontal flight sequence.

A fine episode. Of course, Supergirl can fly through the side of a mountain. You almost do not see it happening. For once we do see Supergirl in horizontal flight. We had rather more of that last season. A few complainers will note that once again Supergirl had to be rescued by someone on the DEO. In contrast, at the end of the pilot Supergirl beat Vartox singlehandedly.

This was really an excellent episode. I am enjoying Lillian Luthor as the villain. I view her as more dangerous than the aliens Supergirl has fought. I also liked Kara being a strong presence. She is Kara Zor-El and Supergirl is her alter ego. They are both one, and I enjoyed her presence on the screen as Supergirl.

Lena Luthor is a great cast addition. She is complicated and it is clear that she adores Kara as her friend. This is a friendship she can trust. (That's my opinion.) Her feelings about Supergirl seem more complicated. It may go back when SG asked for help against her mother. Is she evil? That is the $64,000 question. I hope not, but I am not sure. She is not a black & white character like Kara. Now that she knows she is a true Luthor, does that change things? Here are some thoughts:

* Lillian used her again and forced her to participate.
* Lillian abandoned her when the mountain was going to blow.
* Supergirl saved her life once again

What impact this may have is an unknown. In may wqys, I find Lena the most interesting character of the season and I hope she continues. She adds a richness to the program and a complexity of character.

Argo

That was an entertaining episode, 9.5 out of 10, probably the 2nd best episode of the season (behind The Adventures of Supergirl) for me.

Highlights
- First and foremost it was so good to see the Superheroics that I love so much again when Supergirl saved the crane and then smiled to the appreciation of the people she'd just saved. A big from me at seeing that.
- Really appreciated seeing the Superfriends back together again, having a drink at the bar, some good Kara and Winn interaction, Kara and James hugging and agreeing to just be good friends again. Good feelings
- Melissa Benoist, great performance as Kara in this episode especially with her belief that Lena was innocent.
- Always a pleasure to see Snapper Carr, really enjoy Ian Gomez in the role.
- Blake Neely, I say this pretty much every week but the man brings some great music to the show and this episode was no exception.
- Peter Gadiot, loved his one scene at the end as Mxy, should be plenty of fun and frolics next week.

Ladies and gentlemen... I introduce you to... The Morgana Pendragon death glare. Study closely, folks... Then go back to the last shot of Lena. Muah ha ha ha Katie McGrath is the bombdiggity

p. S. Was anyone ELSE creeped out by Little Lena's... "I really like this game"???? Pretty sure she's related to the twin girls from "The Shining"....."redrum...redrum." lol